Is Torture Ever Acceptable?
POSTED IN: Blog Posts, Makes You Think
Over the last few weeks more and more information has been released on the CIA’s use of waterboarding to gain information from so-called “high value” terrorist suspects.
Water-boarding is a centuries-old practice used to coerce prisoners during interrogations by using water to cut off oxygen and to create both the feeling and fear of drowning. It is the eminent “fear of death” that interrogators use to force information out of the prisoners.
Advocates for water-boarding, sleep-deprivation, sweatboxes and other similar methods of interrogation say that these methods are acceptable because they cause no “lasting damage” to the prisoner.
Do the Ends Justify the Means?
Many Americans subscribe to the “ends justifies the means” argument that says as long as valuable information is obtained that would save the lives of hundreds or even thousands, drastic measures are indeed justified. After all, it always works for Jack Bauer, right?
I’ll be honest, I have a really tough time with issues like this. I’d like to think that I’d never condone any type of torture but then again, if I knew my family could be the victim of a terrorist attack and that a prisoner knew information that could prevent it, well, I don’t know if I would be quite so objective.
Romans 13 talks about the government needing the protect the innocent and punish those that do wrong. If another 9-11 can be prevented through extreme interrogation techniques like water-boarding, wouldn’t we be justified in getting our hands dirty with a few high-value prisoners?
What do you think?
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April 28, 2009
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Without getting into the fact that these methods HAVEN’T given us any actionable intelligence and that a tortured person will tell you whatever you want to hear (just read a little of Gulag Archipelago), no. Torture is NEVER OK!
How are we as Americans going to say that our country is founded on the individual liberty and equality of everyone, then turn around and deprive another human being of their liberty and equality?
p.s. Our country has imprisoned many people over the years for water-boarding, including a police officer in Texas while W. was governor! But now it’s ok???
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April 28, 2009
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I absolutely believe in using torture to obtain information from those with evil intent! I believe in saving lives both physically and spiritually!
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April 28, 2009
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Would you be willing to harm a person with evil intent to save 1,000 innocent people?
If your wife was about to die, and someone knew how to save her, but wouldn’t tell you because of hate – is it the godly thing to simply say ok, and let her die?
Right or wrong…I’d do anything to save my wife – and innocent people are somebody’s wife, or husband, or child.
I think the word “torture” can describe a variety of methods – some of which are unnecessary and wrong, but this is turning into a politically correct trend that is pressuring people to act, look, and BELIEVE certain ways.
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April 28, 2009
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I’m not going to weigh in on this topic other than to say this:
With the release of this information, the US is now less secure. A paper lion is still scary if you don’t know it is paper. Once you do, it has lost its bite… other than a nasty papercut.
To answer Barry, we don’t know these methods HAVENT worked. All we know is that all attempts since 9/11 have been thwarted.
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April 28, 2009
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Does anyone find it ironic that the same people on the current witch hunt for anyone who might have authorized the torture of known terrorists…. are the same people who brought us legalized, even tax funded abortions (humming along past 50,000,000,000+) The same people are currently pressing hard to expand and fund abortion around the world… at the same time weeping over the water boarding of terrosists.
Is this not mind boggling?
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April 28, 2009
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IMHO: yes it is acceptable. I do not find it in the category of denying individual liberty when a terrorist knows info about other possible attacks.
To Brian: I 100% agree. I know of at least two guys right now who say they will not fight (they claim pacifism) if their wives and children were being violated. I say hogwash! Love protects not allows and even if I die in the process I could not possibly live with myself if I knew I allowed someone to rape or kill my family and I never tried to raise a finger.
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April 28, 2009
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I am following in the path of not weighing in. There are really 2 sides to this topic.
I will say I agree with you brother though. The release of this information was a HUGE mistake. This was an idiot move at best.
Great post
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April 28, 2009
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Two things:-
1. The quality of information obtained by these ‘methods’ is always going to be susceptible since often people will say something they think the questioner wants to hear to make things stop.
2. I don’t believe God ever gives us the right to deliberately endanger someone else’s life in this way just to achieve something WE want! Let’s always remember it’s about God’s will but more than that to God ALL life is of value.
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April 28, 2009
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I am for it…Water boarding is just a simulation of drowning for one and they won’t die… If it works bring it on…I believe the agents know that prisoners will say anything, but if they are being water boarded multiple times something will come out. No attack since 9/11 thank you W. you aren’t half as bad a people say…. Also please keep in mind these people being held are terrorist who hide behind women and children in the streets and use them as human shields…not much sympothy on my part for them…water board away…..
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April 28, 2009
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When a person withholds information that may undermine our national security I would not want our government to sit idle and let an attack occur when we hold a prisoner that knows something about it. Waterboarding is a torture that does not leave any long term effects and is used to obtain information. If I were a prisoner; I would give up information before I would let them do that to me!
There are many things that the government does that we will never know; and personally, I would rather not know. I am perfectly fine with it. And I do not mind paying for the defense of my country if it includes torture. The point is that they do what they do to keep us safe – and they have not failed to do so in 8 years.
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April 29, 2009
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I would rather get answers by waiting upon God and praying, rather than trying to manipulate and force it out of others!
I would rather “save lives” by waiting upon God and praying than by trying to do the saving myself–whether by torture or (on the opposite extreme) by thinking it’s my job to save (or rescue) them spiritually.
Really, there’s not enough real trust in Him any more in this world. We seem to think so many things are in our control, when really they aren’t at all.
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April 29, 2009
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To say you wouldn’t want someone waterboarded even if it would save the life of your family is a bit ridiculous. Pacifism is fine, but atleast be willing to do what’s necessary to keep your family safe. It’s like people saying they wouldn’t be able to shoot someone that was threatening their family’s life. Uh, pass the Glock over here then, spineless one.
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April 29, 2009
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From what I have read, they test to see how accurate the information they get is by asking some questions they already know the answers to. So they have an idea about whether or not the person is just saying something to make them stop or if the person is telling the truth. This makes a lot of sense.
Depending on who you read, they got information from waterboarding those three guys that allowed them to break up a 17-person cell in LA that was planning a ’second wave’ 9/11 style attack on LA. Although others report that they waterboarded them simply to try to get a link between 9/11 and Iraq, a confession they never got. That in itself seems to argue against the thought that people will say whatever you want to hear to make it stop.
Complicated issue for sure…
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April 29, 2009
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Would it be ok for Iran to torture Americans if they believed that it would save Iranian lives?
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April 30, 2009
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Barry,
i think so…if they found out americans were planning on flying two planes into a large metropolitan area and killing thousands, that is.
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May 1, 2009
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YES! War is ugly. Terrorism is ugly. We must take these steps to protect the innocent.
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May 6, 2009
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Wow. I had this same discussion over lunch today. I think torture sucks. But if you can get good info that will save many lives, than I am leaning towards allowing it. And why is waterboarding such the culprit? Is breaking fingers okay? Or that stuff that Jack Bauer injects into people to make their blood burn?
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May 6, 2009
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Maybe a few things to ponder.
Would it be acceptable if not water-boarding but rape? Why, Why not?
And if, as it turns out the genuine reason for using the water-board was political, in that a connection was needed to be made between the 9/11 terrorists and Iraq, would that still make water-boarding acceptable?
I have another line of questions that I would be interested in some response. The language of the political right in the United States tends to be framed in terms of the discipline father. The political left in the United States tend to frame issues as the nurturing mother. Is it the language that we are using tripping us up, preventing us from finding common ground?
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May 8, 2009
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Is the use of torture ever ok…you bet it is…as father I do have morals and priciples but if my child was kidnapped and torture could save her life…I would rather live with decision to have tortured than to stand on her grave saying I stood on my morals and principle. If torture would save your life would you want it done? It’s like if you had to shoot someone to save a life, I would not want to have to do it but I would without hesitation.
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May 12, 2009
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What if the person being tortured is innocent or has no relevant knowledge?
You don’t even have to torture the suspect; just torture a loved one — their child/wife/mother — that should get most people to talk. (I believe Saddam liked to use that method.)
Since torture is effective, shouldn’t it be used on criminals?
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October 16, 2009
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i think torture is definatly acceptable. im 16 and about to join the military in a couple of months and i think if there was a situation where i needed some information and had to tourture someone to get i would..would i feel bad of course but id also feel like i did everything in my power to possibly save someone elses live too
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March 2, 2010
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I agree with Brian’s comment. Torture should be used to extract information and not as some sort of punishment.
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March 18, 2010
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Romans 13 says nothing about the government protecting you, it says that we need to sumbit to the government
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April 23, 2010
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look guys they use torturein other counrtys i am in the marines and we train our selves to not crack under preasure they use the water boared in traing and it is very useful but there is ways around it trust me i have been there and back look i am 17 years old and Kayla ReAnne Harris you are right you would be doing the right thing you may not feel the best but no matter you must do what you think is right.